Ford 6.0 injector operation ?

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  • greasybob
    Senior Member
    • May 2008
    • 1590

    Ford 6.0 injector operation ?

    Recently I was working on an 07 F350 with a 6.0 diesel, out of curiousity I back probed an injector to check it's operation and add to my wave form library. This is what I got, I understand this injector has two solenoids, one to let the oil in and one to release the pressure what I'm not sure of is why the FIMC continues to activate the injector close solenoid continually after the firing cycle as you can see in the screen shot. Any ideas? This is a normally operating injectors and the engine runs smooth.
    Attached Files
  • greasybob
    Senior Member
    • May 2008
    • 1590

    #2
    Well, I think I figured this out, the injector uses a spool valve to control oil flow against the intensifier piston and there's no return spring so the FICM continues to activate the closed solenoid to make sure the spool stays in place until the next firing. I took one apart to check it out. I've noticed that some injectors won't fire on cold starts, after a few minutes when the engine warms up they start hitting on all cylinders, still trying to find what wears in these injectors.
    Attached Files

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    • diesel71
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2008
      • 921

      #3
      bob you are right about the ficm holding the spool valve closed,it"s to stop the high pressure oil from entering the intensifier piston chamber.

      what wears is the injector plunger,most 6.0 injector failers are from low fuel pressure and or water in the fuel. when fuel pressure drops below 45psi,the intensifier piston in the injector is damaged by lack of fuel to dampen it"s stroke.
      the solenoids that open and close the spool valve use 48 volts and 20 amps to work right so low voltage or a poor working ficm will cause misfires.

      the spool valve only has .017 inch to move back and forth, when you get a 6.0 that has a mis when cold,then runs fine when warm thats sticking spool valves. when the oil is cold and thick the spool valve solenoids cant open and close the valve right so that cylinder will mis. when the oil is warm and thin it will flow threw the valve right and allow the injector to inject fuel right.
      ford has had several updated flash"s to help with the cold start sticky spool valves.
      I love your screen shots and have done that myself but to tell the truth most injector failures occur in the lower portion of the injector and i have found that checking the waveforms didnt help. It is interesting to view them.

      Comment

      • juzatheman
        Junior Member
        • Sep 2010
        • 1

        #4
        do the open and close coils use same 48v power?
        or do there come two separated 48v wires from FIMC to the injector?

        FIMC to each injertor goes 4 wires:
        -open coil pwr
        -open coil gnd
        -close coil pwr
        -close coil gnd
        right?

        if i meassured engine running unpuggin injectors one by one, from FIMC to each injector come only one wire +46v and one +19v/+23v last two no volts.

        is this right??? i would think there should come two wires that 46volts..

        if i meassured the FIMC there is that one torx on power circuitboard that 46V (7 pin FIMC), but i dont think that is the whole truth that the FIMC is OK . if im understanding it right the 46v still have to go through logigboard(inside fimc) to each injector at 8 or 16 pins depending does each injector get one or two wires with 46v.

        please help a little, i dont have the proper wirring diagrams where i could see this unambiguously..

        only find some blur images form web.
        Last edited by juzatheman; 10-11-2010, 01:09 PM.

        Comment

        • randalpho
          Junior Member
          • Oct 2010
          • 8

          #5
          Stiction is a major problem on the 6.0L Powerstroke as well as all the engines that use the spool valve, so much that Navistar had Hickok make their dealers a stiction tester. It measures the delay time using the opposite solenoid as the solenoid that is currently being actuated.

          You can view a video on Hickok's website of the G2 tester. It works on other Navistar engines besides the 6.0L.

          We develop and manufacture automotive diagnostic tools for service technicians in the automotive and truck repair industries. We provide a variety of automotive test equipment including scan tools, emissions testing equipment, circuit testers, fuel injector testers, and pressure test & measurement equipment.

          Comment

          • diesel71
            Senior Member
            • Feb 2008
            • 921

            #6
            Originally posted by juzatheman
            do the open and close coils use same 48v power?
            or do there come two separated 48v wires from FIMC to the injector?

            FIMC to each injertor goes 4 wires:
            -open coil pwr
            -open coil gnd
            -close coil pwr
            -close coil gnd
            right?

            if i meassured engine running unpuggin injectors one by one, from FIMC to each injector come only one wire +46v and one +19v/+23v last two no volts.

            is this right??? i would think there should come two wires that 46volts..

            if i meassured the FIMC there is that one torx on power circuitboard that 46V (7 pin FIMC), but i dont think that is the whole truth that the FIMC is OK . if im understanding it right the 46v still have to go through logigboard(inside fimc) to each injector at 8 or 16 pins depending does each injector get one or two wires with 46v.

            please help a little, i dont have the proper wirring diagrams where i could see this unambiguously..

            only find some blur images form web.
            what exactly is it your trying to test? I see no reason to buy a differant tool to test the 6.0 injectors, use the functional tests/injector disable command.
            this may help,
            IF you suspect sticking injector spool valves and have no codes go to functional test then select injector disable command. on that screen you will have some pid data availble, watch the engine load % and get a good average,now disable that injector and see if the average % changes. IF the injector you just cut out is working right and not sticking the % will go up. IF the injector is bad or not working the % will stay about the same. now if the injector has a sticky spool valve but is still fireing once and awhile the % will go up but not as mutch as a known good one. It take some time and testing but once you do this a few times its easy.
            we can use the (mfdes) mass fuel desired data too.
            look at the mfdes data and get an average baseline number, the masdes will fluctuate rapidly so take a five second snapshot and record the high and low numbers to get an average.say it read 10.0 to 11.0 so your average baseline would be 10.5, now disable each injector and record the high and low numbers then write them down. do this for each injector. now derive the average for each injector.
            example, cylinder number 1 has a reading of 10.5-10.9 therefore the equation would be 10.5 + 10.9=21.4 divided by2=10.7 now,subtract this number from the average baseline mfdes recorded befor you cut any out. example, cylinder 1 has average mfdes of 10.7 and the baseline average was 10.1, the equation would be 10.7-10.1=0.6 therefore 0.6 would be the deviation from the baseline. now you can look and see witch injectors deveate from the baseline and ether are not working or have sticking spool valves.

            Comment

            • greasybob
              Senior Member
              • May 2008
              • 1590

              #7
              I made a video showing a 6.0 with a cracked injector tip,. didn't get or need much scope data to find it but there also is a couple of videos over there of the effects an after market performance enhancer can have on your scan data, this was on an 07 Dura Max. Watch for this stuff, it can lead you in the wrong direction. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbqLPKgPmx8
              Last edited by greasybob; 01-02-2011, 07:00 AM.

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